User Talk: Eothan

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List of libraries in Australia ↗ page

Hi, Eothan. I restored your edits per this request ↗. However, please don't use block letters for titles. Can you change them back to normal? Thanks. <span style="background:#008000; color:white; padding:2px;">'''Abelmoschus Esculentus'''</span> (talk to me) 13:46, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

will do Eothan (talk) 00:36, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Excessive information on images and external links

Hi, Eothan! I notice you are adding somewhat excessive amounts of information on images and external links, see MOS:CREDITS ↗ and WP:ELCITE ↗. Generally the principle is to add a caption (for images) or commentary on external links sufficient to explain the image/link in terms of the article content. It is expected that meta-data for images is held on Commons and that can be obtained by clicking on the image. So for John King, we just need to say it's John King and give a date if possible and name the place, circumstances etc if it has any relevance e.g. "John King receiving his award from Queen Victoria in Buckingham Palace, 1860". The fact that the image comes from the State Library of NSW isn't really of any relevance to the article; this information should be (and is) on Commons and doesn't need repeating. Similarly, in the Burke and Wills expedition article, I think would be more appropriate to say "Drawings illustrating the Burke and Wills exploring expedition crossing the continent of Australia from Cooper's Creek to Carpentaria Aug 1860-June 1861 ↗ by William Strutt ↗ held at State Library of New South Wales ↗", as clicking through to that link will provide much of the other detail you have included. The point of contributing is to enhance the reader's understanding of the subject matter rather than to promote the source of the material. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. Kerry (talk) 02:16, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Hi Kerry, take your point but I have noticed many cultural institutions are credited on commons uploads to wiki pages ie. Pablo Picasso and closer to home Burke and Wills where there are:

Eugene Montagu Scott, Natives discovering the body of William John Wills, the explorer, at Coopers Creek, June 1861, oil on canvas, 1862, State Library of Victoria which links to the library not the catalogue record

William Hodgkinson, Bulla, Queensland, watercolour, 1861, National Library of Australia. Hodgkinson briefly joined the Burke and Wills expedition at Swan Hill, and was a member of two relief expeditions. Bulla depicts the Victorian Relief Expedition in armed conflict with Bulloo Aborigines.

George Washington Lambert, Burke and Wills on the way to Mount Hopeless, watercolour, 1907, Bendigo Art Gallery

John Longstaff, Arrival of Burke, Wills and King at the deserted camp at Cooper's Creek, Sunday evening, 21 April 1861, oil on canvas, 1907, National Gallery of Victoria

Edward Jukes Greig, Arrival of Burke & Wills at Flinders River, oil on canvas, 1862, State Library of New South Wales

Nicholas Chevalier, Memorandum of the Start of the Exploring Expedition, oil on canvas, 1860, Art Gallery of South Australia

I was thinking that in someways it does make sense to show readers about which institution and which country the images are held in without making them move to another page? Have you had this discussion with other intsitutions?

The extra descriptive content I added to give readers a fuller description of the content held in an album or manuscript collection thinking this would allow users to decide whether the content was worth their following up or not. I am happy to shorten if you think this doesn't add to the usefulness of the entry. I have to say I have been adding updates as they come up as a part of my research here at work so hope this isn't complicating things. Cheers Geoff. Eothan (talk) 03:36, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

:I agree the Burke and Wills expedition ↗ article is full of bad examples of captions (and I have noted it in my list of things to clean up), but "two wrongs don't make a right". Your caption "Robert O'Hara Burke ↗ by William Strutt ↗" is more acceptable than most of the captions of artworks in that article, which appear to emphasise the artist and the institution over what is being depiction. In photo captions, it is allowed to give artist credit if they are notable artists. Pablo Picasso ↗ is different as he is an artist and the images are of his works and the galleries which hold an artist's work form part of the information about the artist himself. His greatness as an artist is demonstrated by his works being held in leading galleries. The policy on captions is pretty clear and I do outreach work all the time with libraries including with the State Library of Queensland (who have donated tens of thousands of images to Wikimedia Commons) and am a member of the Wikipedia and Libraries User Group steering committee ↗. The question to ask yourself is "do I know more about the Burke and Wills expedition because I know that image comes from the SLNSW or because there are 3 oval windows?" and I think the answer has to be No. The naming of the institution is more useful in the external link, as that is helpful to the reader to decide if this external link might be worth viewing, but again the policy is to be "brief" in the commentary which should address the relevance. Finally we do not put external links in the body of article or in photo captions (only as part of citations and in infobox fields that specifically ask for a URL). You might find this helpful Wikipedia:GLAM/Getting started ↗, noting some of the "key questions". Kerry (talk) 04:44, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Hi Kerry,
have changed the captions and from now on am presuming captions referring to institutions only viable if the fact an item is held by a cultural institution promotes the status of the creator or if the actual painting/photo was notable enough for a page in its own right ie if the Guernica image was to appear on a page about the town it would not refer to the institution. Cheers Geoff. Eothan (talk) 05:00, 8 August 2018 (UTC)
::Well that is how I would interpret the policy, but as it happens, the article about the town does include the institution. Kerry (talk) 05:37, 8 August 2018 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:Antidesma Dallachyanum ↗

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Hello, Eothan. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation ↗ submission or Draft ↗ page you started, "Antidesma Dallachyanum ↗".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace ↗, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply {{edit|Draft:Antidesma Dallachyanum|edit the submission}} and remove the {{tlc|db-afc}}, {{tlc|db-draft}}, or {{tlc|db-g13}} code.

If your submission has already been deleted by the time you get there, and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion by following the instructions at this link ↗. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing.  Hhkohh (talk) 03:25, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation ↗: List of Fairfax Media Limited Business Archive (August 13)

<div style="border: solid 1px #FCC; background-color: #F8EEBC; padding: 0.5em 1em; color: #000; margin: 1.5em; width: 90%;"> 50px|left ↗Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation ↗ has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time.<nowiki> </nowiki>The reason left by Dan arndt was:

{{divbox|gray|3=This submission's references do not show that the subject qualifies for a Wikipedia article ↗—that is, they do not show ''significant'' coverage (not just passing mentions) about the subject in ''published'', ''reliable'' ↗, ''secondary'' ↗ sources that are ''independent ↗'' of the subject. Before any resubmission, additional references meeting these criteria should be added (see technical help ↗). If no additional references exist, the subject is not suitable for Wikipedia.|}} The comment the reviewer left was:

{{divbox|blue|3=Fails WP:GNG ↗, lacks any sources or references.}} Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit <u>when they have been resolved</u>.
{{clear}}

If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to User:Eothan/List of Fairfax Media Limited Business Archive and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.

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Dan arndt (talk) 05:00, 13 August 2018 (UTC)</div>

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State Library of New South Wales ↗

Just by way of education (not criticising you), the use of an infobox is to describe the *topic* of the article, so it wasn't appropriate to add the infobox declaring this was the article about Sydney. So only add an infobox if it is directly about the topic. But I could see what you were trying to do (add a map), so I did it using the fields of the library infobox template that specify coords and specific a map on which to display coords (you could have a map of NSW or a map of Sydney or a map of central Sydney as the base map if you preferred -- the latter looks quite nice). You might well ask at this point "how was I supposed to know that?" to which my answer is "you probably couldn't" as documentation isn't one of our strengths :-( Even if you go to the documentation :Template:Infobox library ↗ you will see the field "coords" described but not see any mention of the "location_map" field. I confess to looking into the source code to find out what field did the map selection since it wasn't documented but I figured there probably was a way to generate a map. If you are wanting to make maps in infoboxes, the base maps available to you are listed at :Category:Australia location map templates ↗. You use the part of the name after "data/" so use "Australian Sydney central" as the location_map field to see a much more local mapping of the coordinates. Never be afraid to ask, it's often the only way. One place often worth asking questions is the Wikipedia:Australian Wikipedians' notice board ↗. Most of the people who "hang out" there are experienced Australian contributors and familiar with contributing on Australian topics. Or in this case, you might have asked at Template talk:Infobox library ↗. Kerry (talk) 05:23, 13 August 2018 (UTC)

That's excellent - I had a play around with trying to do this but you are right every-time I tried to add a map direct into the info box it failed. The idea of a central city Sydney map sounds good if there is one already in Wikimedia Commons. - thanks Kerry Eothan (talk) 06:22, 13 August 2018 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation ↗: Frederick Spencer Burnell ↗ has been accepted

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Legacypac (talk) 19:41, 18 October 2018 (UTC)</div>

Well done on Frederick Burnell!

However, your links to Daka and Hull need to be disambiguated (i.e. there are more than one Daka article and more than one Hull article). I find it useful to display such links in orange by turning on:

Preference (top right of screen) > Gadgets > Turn on "Display links to disambiguation pages in orange" > Save (lower left)

which makes such things easy to spot. Kerry (talk) 22:02, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi Kerry - taking a while to learn the tricks of the trade - thanks for helping Eothan (talk) 02:15, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
:Gosh yes, there is a lot to learn. I've been here on-wiki since 2005 and I still learn new tricks from time to time. When not sure how to do something, please feel to ask me or ask at the Teahouse. Kerry (talk) 05:15, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

TA! - much appreciated - the more I do the more I feel this is the future for scholarship - I hope the wikiversity and humanities section gets a champion as I think this could really change approaches to research and publication particularly within the GLAM sector. Eothan (talk) 05:55, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
:Well, as it happens, there is a new initiative in this area, see WikiJournal of Humanities ↗ which complements WikiJournal of Medicine ↗ and WikiJournal of Science ↗. WikiJournal Humanities is looking for people interested in submitting and reviewing articles as well as people interested in roles as journal editors and editorial board members, so maybe you can help be a driver of this change. Kerry (talk) 06:02, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

I had a look at this a few weeks back and registered my interest & that I was OK to peer review but activity seems to be limited at the moment. I am sure there are all sorts of reasons but it would be great if there could be a focus on highlighting a role for this perhaps as a scholarship or funded wiki activity to kick start it. I have too much on my plate but am happy to support an initiative in this direction. Eothan (talk) 06:14, 21 October 2018 (UTC)

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User:Eothan/List of Fairfax Media Limited Business Archive

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Hello, Eothan. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation ↗ submission or draft ↗ page you started, User:Eothan/List of Fairfax Media Limited Business Archive.

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace ↗, the draft has been deleted. If you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion by following the instructions at this link ↗. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it. — JJMC89 <small>(T'''·'''C ↗)</small> 17:36, 1 March 2019 (UTC)

Linking articles

Please don't use urls, just use this sort of bracket <nowiki>name ↗</nowiki>. See Help:link ↗. Thanks. <span style="color:#070">Doug Weller</span> talk 10:36, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

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Sydney talk page

Hello. I noticed you removed three comments by other editors while making your comment as you can see here ↗. I’m assuming this was a mistake but be careful, as this could be misinterpreted as bad faith. '''<span style="color: darkgreen">IWI</span>''' (''<span style="color: purple">chat</span>'') 00:42, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
:Apologies - yes there was a message saying edits had been updated at the same time and I didn't realise I had deleted the other messages. Sorry. Eothan (talk) 01:05, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
::Yes I suspected that. No harm done in the end it’s ok. '''<span style="color: darkgreen">IWI</span>''' (''<span style="color: purple">chat</span>'') 01:44, 10 January 2020 (UTC)

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List of female bullfighters

25px|alt=Information icon ↗ Hi Eothan! I noticed that you recently marked an edit as minor at :List of female bullfighters ↗ that may not have been. "Minor edit" has a very specific definition on Wikipedia{{Snd}} it refers only to superficial edits that could never be the subject of a dispute, such as typo corrections ↗ or reverting obvious vandalism ↗. Any edit that changes the ''meaning'' of an article is not a minor edit, even if it only concerns a single word. Please see Help:Minor edit ↗ for more information. Thank you. <span style="color:maroon; font-family:Garamond;">'''Donna Spencer'''</span><sup><span style="color:#E6A817; font-family:times new roman;">''talk-to-me''</span>⛅</sup> 15:07, 22 July 2020 (UTC)

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Thanks I've updated Eothan (talk) 09:15, 3 January 2021 (UTC)

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A kitten for you!

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<span style="box-shadow: 0px 0px 8px red; background-color: black; padding: 3px; color: white"><b><span style="color:orange">EGL</span><sup><span style="color: red">1234</span> ↗</sup></b></span> 05:58, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
<br style="clear: both;"/>

::::{{reply to|EGL1234}}awww ... thanks Eothan (talk) 06:42, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

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Glebe Island

I've seen that other view a lot, but I'm convinced it's not Glebe Island. Water level is too high, hand rails are different, road off the end is wrong, I've not found it yet, but I'd like to be convinced of where it is Dave Rave (talk) 22:53, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
: I'd be happy with Bridge Rd Glebe over the park back when it was a swing bridge, hmm, I have pics of that with a mound bridge, but let's say looking east up the hill into Pyrmont Dave Rave (talk) 23:52, 7 September 2021 (UTC)
:: perhaps Cooks River Dam? Eothan (talk) 00:17, 8 September 2021 (UTC)
:: it has been suggested this is the first bridge at Richmond, NSW. Any thoughts? Eothan (talk) 03:16, 8 September 2021 (UTC)
:: I think this is the Richmond River Bridge - the image in this article seems pretty much confirm it. https://www.hawkesburygazette.com.au/story/3225258/road-history-is-both-long-and-windy/ Eothan (talk) 05:33, 8 September 2021 (UTC)
::: that view of the dead/dying old bridge does look good, also the Pyrmont Bridge looks similar but I doubt it would have a bare hill behind when the city is there Dave Rave (talk) 05:51, 8 September 2021 (UTC)
::: our bridge looks to be two spans wide, three verticals, the remains of the richmond bridge looks to be three spans wide, there's four sets of piers, but looking and emailing Kurrajong Comlery Historical Dave Rave (talk) 06:10, 8 September 2021 (UTC)
::: this view looks width okay ↗ Dave Rave (talk)

Books & Bytes – Issue 46

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== Trolling on Brisbane page ==
Cease your trolling of the Brisbane ↗ History section, you're a Sydneysider and your deleting vast chunks of the history section. I have reported you at Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism ↗--Caltraser5 (talk) 00:37, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
:This was not my intent, I was tidying up the layout and all I did was rearrange the content and add a panoramic imaage of Brisbane from 1872. I did not delete any content from the page except a minor rearranging of words of a caption? Eothan (talk) 00:49, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
::You've destroyed my work, do I go on the Sydney ↗ page and trash your history article? No, so don't come onto my cities page and trash mine. Go and fix the mess you made.--Caltraser5 (talk) 00:55, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
:::Caltraser5, I'm not entirely sure what happened there, but Special:Diff/1062875839 ↗ shows you duplicating an image and Special:Diff/1062879717 ↗ shows you complaining about the self-created duplication afterwards. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 01:02, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
:::All back to your old layout - apologies if it caused any issues for you. Best. Eothan (talk) 01:32, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
::::Sorry for the outburst Eothan, but I thought you were a troll trying to destroy the Brisbane history section. I didn't mind the panorma but I don't know why you went and deleted the convict images, and the other 19th century images. If you want to contribute to the section you're welcome to, as I'm the only person who's really done anything with it. But I'd rather you not delete the convict images unless you can suggest a better format for them. I based that section off the Moscow ↗ history section which I thought looked good.--Caltraser5 (talk) 02:16, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

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Books & Bytes – Issue 49

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Speedy deletion ↗ nomination of :Harry W. Furniss ↗

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A tag has been placed on :Harry W. Furniss ↗ requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G12 of the criteria for speedy deletion ↗, because the page appears to be an unambiguous copyright infringement ↗. This page appears to be a direct copy from https://archival.sl.nsw.gov.au/Details/archive/110330173. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images taken from other web sites or printed material, and as a consequence, your addition will most likely be deleted. You may use external websites or other printed material as a source of ''information'', but not as a source of ''sentences''. This part is crucial: ''say it in your own words''. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators '''will be blocked from editing ↗'''.

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Edits on Peter Nicol Russell ↗

Hello! I have been substantially reworking Peter Nicol Russell ↗ as part of a university project. Firstly, thank you for your interest in further improving the article. I have noticed that you have added back the image of workers assembled outside the P. N. Russell & Co works. In your caption you mention that Russell himself is depicted in the image, however I have been unable to find evidence to support this. Are you able to either revise this edit to update its accuracy, or otherwise insert where you found that Russell is depicted in the image?

Also, I just wanted to check what the protocol is with inserting images in the article. In Talk:Peter Nicol Russell#Feedback from Rangasyd ↗, they mention that they converted the images to thumb size as it is unnecessary to have images any bigger since this distracts from the eye. I tend to agree with Rangasyd, so are you happy for me to revert these changes?

Thanks! Chasseur99 (talk) 23:23, 1 May 2022 (UTC)

Absolutely I just thought it help given the level of detail in the picture- as to pn Russell I can take this ref out - I thought comparing his portrait image and the fact he was centre of the image in top hat was enough to make the call. But if you have been doing research and say it isn't will update caption and wikicommons upload. Nice article by the way. Thanks. Eothan (talk) 23:29, 1 May 2022 (UTC)

:Sorry for not getting back sooner but not a problem at all. Thanks for having a look at this! Chasseur99 (talk) 01:11, 8 May 2022 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 50

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Issue 52, July – August 2022
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Books & Bytes – Issue 53

New collections:

* Edward Elgar

* E-Yearbook

* Corriere della Serra

* Wikilala

Collections moved to Library Bundle:

* Ancestry

New feature: Outage notification

Spotlight: Collections indexed in EDS

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{{Re|SunDawn}} thank you Eothan (talk) 08:49, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 54

New collections:

* British Newspaper Archive

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1Lib1Ref 2023

Spotlight: EDS Refine Results

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George Baron Goodman

Hi Ethoan, wonderful work on George Baron Goodman ↗ for which I —and no doubt many others — are grateful. The references and pictures are particularly helpful and the narrative engaging. You may be interested in reading David Coombe's article ↗ on the person he calls George ''Barron'' Goodman. Thank you, and I look forward to reading more of your work on Wikipedia. Jamesmcardle<sup>(talk)</sup> 22:55, 29 January 2023 (UTC)

Thanks Eothan (talk) 12:06, 31 January 2023 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 55

New bundle partners:

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Books & Bytes – Issue 56

New partner:

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Library access tips and tricks

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Books & Bytes – Issue 57

Suggestion improvements

Favorite collections tips

Spotlight: Promoting Nigerian Books and Authors

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Books & Bytes – Issue 58

New partners - De Standaard and Duncker & Humblot

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Wikimania presentation

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Books & Bytes – Issue 59

Spotlight: Introducing a repository of anti-disinformation projects

Tech tip: Library access methods

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Books & Bytes – Issue 60

Three new partners

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Books & Bytes – Issue 61

Bristol University Press and British Online Archives now available

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Books & Bytes – Issue 62

IEEE and Haaretz now available

Let's Connect Clinics about The Wikipedia Library

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Books & Bytes – Issue 63

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One new partner

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Books & Bytes – Issue 64

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Issue 64, July – August 2024
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The Hindu Group joins The Wikipedia Library

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Books & Bytes – Issue 65

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Issue 65, September – October 2024
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Books & Bytes – Issue 66

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Books & Bytes – Issue 68

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In this issue we highlight two resource renewals, #EveryBookItsReader, a note about Phabricator, and, as always, a roundup of news and community items related to libraries and digital knowledge.
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Books & Bytes – Issue 69

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In this issue we highlight a new partnership, Citation Watchlist and, as always, a roundup of news and community items related to libraries and digital knowledge.
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Books & Bytes – Issue 70

New collections:

* ''Times of Malta''

* Africa Intelligence

* Intelligence Online

* ''La Lettre''

* ''Glitz''

Spotlight: Wikimania

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Books & Bytes – Issue 71

Spotlight: 1Lib1Ref 2025 in Nigeria

Frankfurt Book Fair

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Books & Bytes – Issue 72

Renewed partnerships

Spotlight: Strengthening Wikimedia Collaborations with and for Open Science

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Citing the digitised newspapers in Trove

Hi, Eothan! Thank you for writing the article on Thomas de la Condamine ↗ (I've just been adding to it). I noticed that you provided many citations from the historic newspapers in Trove, which is great. However, you appear to be copying-and-pasting the APA format citation for each news article rather than the Wikipedia format one which is available if you scroll down on that "Cite" window. E.g.

<nowiki>{{cite news |url=http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article32075049 |title=LIES OF THE DAY. |newspaper=The Sydney Monitor ↗ |volume=VI, |issue=355 |location=New South Wales, Australia |date=2 March 1831 |accessdate=8 February 2026 |page=4 (AFTERNOON) |via=National Library of Australia}}</nowiki>

which produces this citation for the reader:

{{cite news |date=2 March 1831 |title=LIES OF THE DAY. |url=http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article32075049 |accessdate=8 February 2026 |newspaper=The Sydney Monitor ↗ |location=New South Wales, Australia |page=4 (AFTERNOON) |via=National Library of Australia |volume=VI |issue=355}}

The benefit of using the Wikipedia format is that many Wikipedia automated tools can process it for various purposes (e.g. for archiving etc) as they can interpret what the various fields represent. Also it uses Australian date format (rather than American), so it is the better choice. Occasionally, you may get an issue when you get an error message (which is almost always caused by Trove having included a comma at the end of the volume number, but this is easily removed manually).

I also notice that you are using the older text editor rather than the newer Visual Editor (which is more like using Microsoft Word) which greatly simplifies content writing because you don't need to get right all the weird punctuation (square brackets, curly brackets, etc) as it does it all for you. And (as someone who also started with the text editor), you can switch between the two tools as you are working, so if something is easier to do in text mode (e.g. I prefer to do infoboxes in text mode), it takes one click to switch between the two tools within the edit you are performing (and you can switch back and forward as much as you like -- the best of both worlds). I am a Wikimedia Australia volunteer trainer. If you are interested to learn the Visual Editor, we can have a Zoom session at a mutually agreeable time so I can introduce you to the Visual Editor. You can contact me at kerry.raymond@wikimedia.org.au Kerry (talk) 01:40, 8 February 2026 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 73

Four new partnerships

User survey thanks

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Books & Bytes – Issue 74

New partnership: Swissdox

User survey results

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