User Talk: GrinningIodize

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Trouted

{{trout}}
You have been trouted for: who up trouting they out

''The Signpost'': 21 April 2026

<div lang="en" dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"><div style="column-count:2;"> {{Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2026-04-21}} </div> <div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * '''Read this Signpost in full ↗''' * Single-page ↗ * Unsubscribe ↗ * MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:47, 21 April 2026 (UTC) </div></div>

A little help with AI?

Hello there! You seem to be quite versed in this whole issue with AI plaguing the wiki (I was scrolling through the advice page for AI usage and stumbled upon you in discussions). So, I thought you'd be interested in helping me trying to identify a new WP:Signs of AI writing ↗?

I've been going through "all" the pages where AI-generated ↗ maintenance tags have been placed and I'm seeing a pattern which, to my knowledge, haven't been discussed before. We'll be mostly going through the source code of these pages to catch the signs. The "we" here referring to a team im hoping to gather—starting with you!

Hope I'm not bothering. And if you have some questions please ask or don't want to, perfectly fine. Hope to hear your thoughts.

PeepeeDino (talk) 11:15, 23 April 2026 (UTC)

:I'd love to help! Do you have some examples of this novel pattern? GrinningIodize (talk) 12:49, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
::I've only gone through a couple dozen (and because of my insistence, a the ''pattern'' in this case would only emerges after around 2500 pages based on how many AI tagged articles?) but from observations it would seem like whenever a LLM tries to use the >ref name/< feature, every other instance of the citation will have a very suspicious gap before closing (Had to reverse the arrows cause they got hidden, damn!).
::Take Derrell Coley ↗ for instance, after the first cite, the second time they use it, the "/>" is separated by a gap. Now, for most, it would seem like a editors own preferences, but the list goes on; Akure Forest Reserve ↗, American defense of Taiwan ↗, Antiscience ↗, Avant que l'ombre... ↗, Beware of Luxury ↗, Babalawo ↗, Bed rotting ↗, Beyond Aesthetics ↗, Bhimber ↗, Bingham University ↗, Blue light bandits ↗.
::Mind you, this is only from August of ''last year''. And I haven't touched on the letter C yet. Of course, to inspect each one of the source codes for each of these articles is a feverishly boring and repetitive task (and again, see above for my number of article I target)
::Like to see what you think of this and if any wordings felt a little off or a bit confusing please do tell.
::PeepeeDino (talk) 13:33, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
:::Hmm... maybe someone could write a tool that finds articles with this inconsistency? GrinningIodize (talk) 13:35, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
::::Undoubtedly, I'd love for there to be a tool to detect these. However I've never had much experience on the more technical side of Wikipedia.
::::Which also brings me to something I forgot to say, finding more people to help on this would be great. I'm semi-frequent on here and don't really interact much with other editors to know their "speciality". Although I am actively finding other people that could lend a hand, any assistance from you in finding anyone would also be quite nice.
::::PeepeeDino (talk) 13:42, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
:::::My specialty is deleting articles and making pedantic fixes, but I also build my experimental WikiClicky tool. I can probably put something together for this too. GrinningIodize (talk) 13:44, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
:::Can you send me a couple of examples of the AI references and the normal references, so I can study the patterns and get a better idea of what you're talking about? GrinningIodize (talk) 13:48, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
::::Oh, that's really great! Already cutting down on unnecessary scrolling if the tool comes together. Give me some time to find more articles that follow the pattern (and adjacent articles that are not AI-generated ↗ for it too?). It might look a little clunky but I'll give the bare drafts so you can see what's really the scope the tool would search for. PeepeeDino (talk) 13:55, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
:::::Awesome! Thanks so much! GrinningIodize (talk) 15:45, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
::::::July 2025:
::::::* 1080i ↗ — >ref name=":1" /< | A contradiction would be 1080p ↗ which has a few of them mixed with "normal" way of citing. Again, like most signs, it's merely a high probable deduction rather than an outright telltale sign.
::::::(But notice the title of the reference? That will be important for the remaining examples)
::::::*1927 Farm Creek flood ↗ — >ref name=":1" /< | Again, 1966 flood of the Arno ↗ does the same but the title are 'relevant' towards what the citations really source.
::::::*Manoranjan Bhattacharya (revolutionary) ↗ – >ref name="Kali Charan Ghosh 2012" /< | As opposed to Basawon Singh ↗'s <ref name="Jha 2014"/>
::::::*William E. Bonini ↗ — >ref name=":1" /<. Also, notice how they invoke the source ''later'' rather than invoking it first, then using the shortcut. | But Suzanne Carbotte ↗ perplexes me. Have the default always been a semicolon and number? And then the numbers are not arranged properly...
::::::* Brasil Ladies Cup ↗ — >ref name=":0" /<.
::::::*C. R. Chandrashekar ↗ — >ref name="padma" /<. This one's interesting. Only the first appears to have a gap while others don't. I believe that's the editor trying to remove the "evidence" of the copy pasted wikitexts.
::::::* Mark DiDia ↗ — >ref name=":0" /< | Good example would be Adam Duritz ↗ with >ref name="billboard.com"/<
::::::* Franklin Street Lower Free Bridge ↗ — >ref name=":0" /<
::::::* Gang de la Brise de Mer ↗ — >ref name=":1" /<>ref name=":0" /<. Double whammy
::::::* Ekaterina Gordon ↗ — >ref name="7days" /<. More "creative" one to say the least (in terms of title). Follows the same formula though.
::::::* ICP Raxaul ↗ — >ref name="LPAI" /<
::::::* Branden Leslie ↗ — >ref name=":0" /<
::::::* Malingering of post-traumatic stress disorder ↗ — >ref name="Alozai_McPherson2" /<
::::::* Military ranks of Brazil ↗ — >ref name=":10" /<
::::::* Yoosuf Maaniu Mohamed ↗ — >ref name=":0" /<. Also, isn't it nonsensical for the supposed 12th citation of the article to be titled ":0"?
::::::* Udodi Onwuzurike ↗ — >ref name=wa /<
::::::* Sandy Roberton ↗ — >ref name=":1" /<. Another case where the source was invoked ''before'' the ref was defined.
::::::* Sex and the City ↗ — >ref name=":0" /<. Another case like the one directly above
::::::* Single Parents Wellbeing ↗ — >ref name=":4" /<
::::::* The Eras Tour Book ↗ — >ref name=":2" /<
::::::*Paola Velez ↗ — >ref name=":5" /<
::::::* VinFuture Prize ↗ — >ref name="vinfuture1222" /<
::::::Now, based on a these findings and my scattered footnotes, it's clear that it doesn't really act as a sign itself. Like most WP:Signs of AI writing ↗, it is really just a strong indicator that, when pairing with other signs, make it much more likely to be AI-generated.
::::::It's not perfect and at some times seem trivial—but again, I don't see other editors pointing this jarring difference out. If you need any more AI-references or normal ones do feel free to tell. Hope the data isn't too confusing! (Also the arrows will have to be rearranged of course, just a way to get them to appear without being hidden) PeepeeDino (talk) 23:20, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
:::::::Will look into it tomorrow, thanks! GrinningIodize (talk) 23:30, 23 April 2026 (UTC)
::::::::Sorry about being so late, a bit occupied this week. Don't currently have a new ETA. GrinningIodize (talk) 22:47, 30 April 2026 (UTC)
:::::::::No worries! I'm sure code like that takes time anyways. I can't even be bothered with html let alone any detection type of bot lol. PeepeeDino (talk) 01:32, 1 May 2026 (UTC)
::::::::::Yeah, HTML can be quite a hassle. GrinningIodize (talk) 12:41, 1 May 2026 (UTC)

Nobody is "in cahoots"

I'm really not sure what you are talking about with "work together [...] where this sort of collaboration could subvert the intended process".
You already found the place whence several editors came to the deletion discussion for "EML". It was WT:WPM § Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/EML (mathematical operator) ↗. There are a bunch of editors interested in our mathematics related articles who watch WT:WPM ↗, which is a place intended for meta discussion, conflict resolution, and calls to attention related to English Wikipedia coverage of mathematical topics. It's not unusual or suspicious when editors make nearly simultaneous edits when they are actively working on the same article at the same time or participating in an active discussion. –jacobolus ↗ (t) ↗ 16:56, 25 April 2026 (UTC)

:Oh, that explains a lot, thanks. Sorry for the accusations; I retract my statement. GrinningIodize (talk) 17:10, 25 April 2026 (UTC)

Move merge comments?

FYI, looks like a few comments you wrote accidentally ended up on this article page instead of the merge discussion pages: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Regulation_of_artificial_intelligence_in_the_United_States&diff=1354035784&oldid=1353880520 Dreamyshade (talk) 23:40, 13 May 2026 (UTC)

:Whoops! I think that my AfD commenting gadget must have glitched out, my bad. I've fixed it now. GrinningIodize (talk) 23:41, 13 May 2026 (UTC)

''The Signpost'': 22 May 2026

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June 2026 GAN Backlog Drive

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MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 21:58, 25 May 2026 (UTC)

Nomination of :Onyria Group ↗ for deletion

<div class="afd-notice">
<div class="floatleft" style="margin-bottom:0;">48px|alt=|link= ↗</div>A discussion is taking place as to whether the article :Onyria Group ↗ is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines ↗ or whether it should be deleted ↗.

The article is being discussed at '''Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Onyria Group  (2nd nomination) ↗''' until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines ↗.

Users may still edit the article ↗, including to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the AfD notice from the article until the discussion is closed.</div> UtherSRG (talk) ↗ 13:38, 17 June 2026 (UTC)

''The Signpost'': 21 June 2026

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'Avoiding bias'

Just out of curiosity, do you consider this post of yours https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:5G_misinformation&diff=prev&oldid=1189272912 ↗ to be compatible with 'neutrality', and with 'avoiding bias'? AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:27, 10 July 2026 (UTC)

:I retract that statement. GrinningIodize (talk) 16:29, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
::As for whether or not that statement is compatible with neutrality and avoiding bias, I have no comment at this time. GrinningIodize (talk) 16:32, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
:::And yet you retract it. Which is something, I suppose... AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:36, 10 July 2026 (UTC)

Non-negotiables

Special:Diff/1363500532 ↗ Wikipedia has some non-negotiables, and one of them is: don't advocate CP. You seem like a genuine editor, and I could believe I'm taking your words out of context, so I'm not sure you need to be blocked for that edit. But you were riding the line very closely. CP is wrong. It is immoral. And yes, we do block people who express contrary views. We have a zero tolerance policy. <b style="color:#6a1f7f">CaptainEek</b> <sup><i style="font-size:82%; color:#a479e5">Edits Ho Cap'n!</i></sup>⚓ ↗ 19:07, 10 July 2026 (UTC)

:I do not advocate for CP, and I personally oppose it, but I do not believe that my morals (nor anyone else's) on this subject ought to be absolute. Furthermore, I did not express my personal views in that revision, and I specifically stated that discussing them was beyond the point of the topic at hand. Finally, as I stated in my comment, the issue is censorship of machine learning models, not CP.
:I would like to request that you, and by extension all others, refrain from discussing the morality of any form of pornography on my talkpage, when doing so is avoidable. If you wish to discuss these issues, please do them somewhere else. GrinningIodize (talk) 19:14, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
::I agree. We should refrain from those discussions. Which is why I want to issue a necessary and clear warning: further <s>rhetoric</s> <u>statements</u> like Special:Diff/1363500532 ↗ is likely to get you blocked. Barkeep49 (talk ↗) 22:22, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
:::What rule am I likely to break or currently breaking by posting the alleged rhetoric? GrinningIodize (talk) 22:24, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
::::I am happy to change rhetoric to statements and have done so above so that we can get out of the realm of "alleged" because it is not allegation that you wrote Special:Diff/1363500532 ↗. Wikipedia:Child protection ↗ would be the policy basis for sanctions. Thanks for asking and I am glad I could provide this clarity so you remain unsanctioned. Barkeep49 (talk ↗) 22:40, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
:::::At no point have I advocated for romantic or sexual relationships between adults and children, nor have I used Wikipedia as a tool to pursue or facilitate them, nor have I identified myself as a pedophile (I am not one).
:::::It is my view that any sanctions made in the name of the child protection policy against me would be fundamentally-absurd considering these points. If you can find an instance where I have, with reasonable certainty, contradicted any of the statements that I have made in this comment, please alert me to them.
:::::I do not think that it's constructive (or effective) to try and find rule violations in comments that do not contain them, and I would like to request that Wikipedia administrators (including you and CaptainEek) avoid doing so when considering my statements (not to say that any of you have done so), here and at the Village Pump GrinningIodize (talk) 22:51, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
:<s>@CaptainEek Upon further review of WP:CHP ↗, I don't see anything about advocating for CP. Am I misreading this policy or is there another one that I should know about?</s>

:Edit: I retract this question.

:GrinningIodize (talk) 23:01, 10 July 2026 (UTC)
::To be clear: regardless of the policies, I do not intend on advocating for CP. GrinningIodize (talk) 23:02, 10 July 2026 (UTC)