User Talk: Sammyrice

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Nice work

Just thought I'd say nice work on the Pakistani (and Indian) cricket teams – it's messy work sorting out who's who. I made a bit of a list of them if you're ever running short of teams (I thought I'd take a stab at them some time, but that hasn't happened yet – Karachi and Lahore have about 40 between them). Anyway, keep up the good work. '''IgnorantArmies''' 06:15, 11 April 2014 (UTC)

Pakistan Barnstar of National Merit

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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" | '''The Pakistan Barnstar of National Merit'''
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|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | Awarded to you for your valuable contributions on creating/improving articles related to Pakistani cricket ↗. Thank you :) '''Mar4d''' (talk) 15:09, 18 June 2014 (UTC)
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A barnstar for you!

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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Barnstar of Diplomacy'''
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|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Thanks for retaining the edit. I would also like to thank you for creating the page for my grandfather. Chughtai538 (talk) 20:04, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
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Mackintosh

Mackintosh is the conventional spelling of the surname, is there any reason you are changing it to MacKintosh? Flappychappy (talk) 21:53, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
:Elizabeth MacKintosh and her family spelt it with a capital K. It's in the new biography by Jennifer Morag Henderson.Sammyrice (talk) 11:52, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

National Performance Squad

"The National Performance Squad, also known as the Australia National Performance Squad..." Wouldn't it be better to use "Australia National Performance Squad" as the article's title? Until I clicked on the link you provided in Recently Created Articles, I had no idea that the article would be about an Australian squad rather than the equivalent from some other country. JH (talk page) 08:55, 23 August 2016 (UTC)

I don't know. The preferred title seems to be National Performance Squad, which, as the team is unlikely ever to play outside Australia, is probably what it will usually be known as. But I'm happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.Sammyrice (talk) 09:03, 23 August 2016 (UTC)

Excellent work!

Hi Sammyrice, I just wanted to drop to note to say keep up the excellent work in creating new articles on cricketers and cricket in general. Please also consider nominating any further newly created articles for WP:DYK ↗. Articles must be nominated within seven days of being created or being expanded five fold. It would fantastic to see more cricket articles at DYK. All the best – Ianblair23 (talk) 23:29, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

:Ianblair23: Thanks for the kind words and encouragement. I get a great deal of pleasure from researching and writing these little biographies, so it's reassuring to know that some other people are also reading them. Sammyrice (talk) 05:30, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

::You are quite welcome. Like I said, your articles would be a wonderful addition to WP:DYK ↗. Cheers – Ianblair23 (talk) 07:51, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Writer's Barnstar'''
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|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Thanks for creating well-sourced cricket biographies and very well-researched work. Thanks again. '''Störm''' '''(talk)''' 16:12, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
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Eric Norton

I see you reverted my edit on Eric Norton's nickname. I am sorry I did not insert an explanation for the change. Hit the save button before thinking and realised too late. It is interesting that you say that he was definitely known as 'Pop'. Do you have a citation for this? He was my headmaster and maths teacher and to us school boys he was universally known as 'Pope' Norton due to the baldness of his head which gave him a priestly look. I have no ready to hand citation for this, but could probably dig one out in a school history. Not a big issue, but I would be interested to know if in cricket circles he went by the name 'Pop' and the name we knew him by was perhaps an evolution as he grew bald in later years. Greetings from a fellow cricket fan. Waitabout (talk)

:It's included in his obituary in ''Wisden'', 2005, page 1657: '"Pop" Norton was an Eastern Province batsman ...' I suspect the nickname arose in his playing days because he was prematurely bald, and perhaps also because at his playing peak he was older than most of his colleagues. If you can find a citation, we could justifiably include both nicknames.Sammyrice (talk) 11:36, 14 April 2019 (UTC)

Surinder Amarnath

Hello there , I can see you have written some content about Surinder Amarnath - Former Test Cricketer based on the figures and numbers which themselves are available on ESPNCRICINFO.

Wikipedia is suppose to provide information about a Cricketer or a personality. It seems you are unaware of the cricketing scenario in india in the 1970”s and therefore are going on editing Surinder Amarnath”s content without actually knowing what happened in the country at that time. I have newspaper cuttings to prove what I have written but I think according to you only Australians can be great .. is it ? You have conveniently locked the page on the pretext of preventing vandalism whereas writing what you want and then locking the page is vandalism . Habibcricket (talk) 18:20, 25 August 2019 (UTC)
:You are welcome to contribute to Wikipedia. But you must stick to the rules, which are there to make Wikipedia encyclopedic and to keep it from descending into disputation and chaos. All contributions must be supported by verifiable references.Sammyrice (talk) 03:24, 26 August 2019 (UTC)

Hartley Lobban

Thank you so much for updating my father's page. It's mostly correct now. Slight differences only with his working with the RAF. He was a mechanic. He drove buses in London while putting himself through school. Both minor differences. Thanks again! Reading your updated version made me happy today. Quixane (talk) 23:57, 12 October 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Australia Cricket Barnstar'''
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|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | For your incredible work in expanding countless simple stubs into decent articles. Thanks! '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 08:40, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
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:Thanks. That's kind of you.Sammyrice (talk) 12:04, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

South African cricketers

Hi Sammy. Hope you are well. I know you do some excellent expansion work on the more obscure cricket biographies, so if you have either the time and/or inclination, would you be able to help out with five Afds ↗ for South African cricketers? If there is anything more you are able to find about any of them, that would be amazing. No worries if you can't.

And a note for anyone thinking this is canvassing for the AfDs - I'm simply asking someone who has excellent skills in expanding cricket biographies, not to vote stack the related discussions.

Thanks and have a great Christmas. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 14:14, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

:I think I've probably rescued Lewis/Cyril Newnham. If I have time later I'll have a look at the others. All the best.Sammyrice (talk) 21:50, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

::Thank you! '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 09:43, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

::Hi again. There's this NZ cricketer ↗ and this NZ cricketer ↗ too, if you able to add anything more to their bios. Thanks again. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 15:06, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

:::I've expanded Gale somewhat, and he should be safe now. I can't find much about Anderson though. Sammyrice (talk) 22:50, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

New Zealand cricketers

Hi Sammy - hope you're OK. There was a small batch of NZ cricketers who played for Otago that have been redirected. Again, if you time/interest in expanding any of them, it would be most appreciated.

James Allan (cricketer)‎ ↗

John Allen (cricketer, born 1850) ↗

Lawrence Anderson (cricketer) ↗

Geoff Anderson (cricketer) ↗

Gerald Austin (cricketer) ↗

Thomas Austin (cricketer) ↗

Francis Ayles ↗

I think Gerald Austin is possibly the best one to save, with 29 FC matches. I found something about him being an accountant too. Thanks again. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 12:58, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

:It looks as if there are going to be hundreds of these now, possibly even thousands. It's very frustrating if they are going to change the goalposts, by some opaque new criteria, so late in the game. So much honest constructive work, especially on your part, gets trashed. Anyway, Gerald Austin at least should be salvageable. All the best,Sammyrice (talk) 22:06, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

::Thanks. Yes, it's gone a bit wrong at the moment. Albert Alloo ↗ another example! '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 19:36, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

::Well I went ahead and restored all the articles, and they were then all sent for deletion. There's a LOT of them starting here ↗ on today's AfD log. If any of them jump out as ones you could possibly help with expansion, I would be grateful as always. No worries if not. Thanks again. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 15:23, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

New Zealand cricketers at AfD

Hi Sammyrice. I see Lugnuts has already given you a heads up about New Zealand cricketers being AfD'ed. Some more have appeared ↗. Sadly there doesn't seem to have been much indication from the nominator that they've done WP:BEFORE ↗, so I'd imagine there's a fair few with some quite notable and interesting lives outside of cricket that could disappear. All the best. StickyWicket (talk) 23:02, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

:Yes, there's quite a purge going on. Some of those cricketers' articles can certainly be restored with a bit of expansion. I'll be working on them, when I get the time. Sammyrice (talk) 23:10, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

::There is sadly, and I don't believe it to be in good faith given how rapidly they've been nominated. I've been pointed in the direction of a NZ archive page, so if I can spare the time in between studies I'll muck in. StickyWicket (talk) 16:10, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

A barnstar for you and farewell!

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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" |'''The Cricket Barnstar'''
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|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | For excellent contributions to the cricket project for many years, particularly coverage of Australian, New Zealand, South African and Oxbridge cricketers. StickyWicket (talk) 11:23, 24 January 2021 (UTC)
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:Hi Sammyrice. Been meaning to give you a barnstar for many years, have been a big fan of your quiet diligent work. I've decided to retire, but wanted to wish you all the best. StickyWicket (talk) 11:23, 24 January 2021 (UTC)

::Thanks, StickyWicket. Very kind of you. I'm sorry to hear you're retiring. All the best, and maybe you'll pick up your bat and ball again some time in the future. Sammyrice (talk) 22:58, 24 January 2021 (UTC)

Proposed deletion ↗ of :Indian Universities cricket team ↗

left|link=|alt=Notice|48px| ↗

The article :Indian Universities cricket team ↗ has been proposed for deletion ↗ because of the following concern:
<blockquote>'''Subject doesn't seem notable. Citations are largely from a single source.'''</blockquote>

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons ↗.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary ↗ or on the article's talk page ↗.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{Tlc|proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process ↗, but other deletion process ↗es exist. In particular, the speedy deletion ↗ process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion ↗ allows discussion to reach consensus ↗ for deletion. '''Lightbluerain'''❄ (Talk | contribs ↗) 20:49, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

: I don't know why there is any question about this article's notability. A team that plays 16 first-class matches, usually involving past or future Test players on both sides, is clearly notable. Sammyrice (talk) 23:10, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Redlinked NZ cricketers

Hi Sammyrice, hope all is well. I've made a list of remaining redlinked NZ cricketers, 182 by my reckoning. Thought I'd let you know as this is one of your areas of interest! StickyWicket (talk) 23:22, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

: Thanks. I'll see if I can bring at least one or two of them out of obscurity. Sammyrice (talk) 00:34, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

AfD of interest

Hi Sammy. Hope all is well. I don't know if you can help with this AfD ↗ for a NZ cricketer where only his initial and surname are currently known. And one match for Otago in 1865/66! Thanks again for your great work in NZ cricket biographies over the months too. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 18:00, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

: Thanks. He's a challenge. There were several prominent Richardsons in Dunedin at the time, and all I can find about him so far is that he returned to England in 1866, so there may not be much other information around. But I'll keep looking, when I can spare a moment. Sammyrice (talk) 00:37, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

::Thank you - appreciate any extra info you may find about him. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me 09:29, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

Thank you!

Thank you so much for your articles on my grandfather Vernon Scott Sale and his father Ned Sale. It’s wonderful to read
My dad Don Sale has also enjoyed seeing the summaries you’ve given 2406:5A00:2445:CD00:28DA:52C4:C524:70F2 ↗ (talk) 15:30, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Thanks. I'm very glad you and the family have found them interesting. There may be more to find out about Ned. When I have time I'll see what I can find. Unfortunately, when one searches in the newspaper archives using the word "sale" one gets a lot of wrong leads. Sammyrice (talk) 08:37, 12 March 2022 (UTC)

AfD

Hi Sammy - hope you are well. You may or may not be able to help with this AfD ↗. Thank you. '''Lugnuts''' Fire Walk with Me
:I'm doing my best, but we seem to be up against an immovable force. Sammyrice (talk) 23:39, 29 April 2022 (UTC)

Request

Hi can you please create the articles of Pakistan Army cricket team ↗ and Pakistan Navy cricket team ↗. Similar to the Pakistan Air Force cricket team ↗. These teams plays in Patron's Trophy ↗. Recently Pakistan cricket broad has announced restoration of it's old departmental structure, and departments will completes in Patron's Trophy.https://www.brecorder.com/news/40218269/pcb-restores-all-departmental-district-and-zonal-cricket-bodies ↗

Here are some sources Pakistan cricket board:
https://www.pcb.com.pk/pcb-patrons-trophy-grade-ii-200001/tournament/540.html ↗, https://www.pcb.com.pk/patrons-trophy-grade-ii-201516/tournament/1071.html ↗, https://www.pcb.com.pk/patrons-trophy-grade-ii-201617/tournament/1102.html ↗, https://www.pcb.com.pk/patrons-trophy-grade-ii-201819/tournament/1192.html ↗,

Other sources: https://www.thenews.com.pk/amp/457776-patron-s-trophy-g-ii-cricket-begins-today ↗, https://www.dawn.com/news/799789/three-new-teams-to-compete-in-patrons-trophy-grade-ii ↗

Pakistan Navy cricketers https://www.pcb.com.pk/averages-reports.php?action=team_averages&tournament_id=900&match_type=&team_id=10930&match_type_id=6 ↗

Pakistan Army cricketers.https://www.pcb.com.pk/averages-reports.php?action=team_averages&tournament_id=900&match_type=&team_id=10934&match_type_id=6 ↗

Pakistan Air Force cricketers.https://www.pcb.com.pk/averages-reports.php?action=team_averages&tournament_id=716&match_type=&team_id=6781&match_type_id=6 ↗

You can find more sources by searching Patron's Trophy or Patron's Trophy Pakistan Army/Navy cricket Team. 202.69.12.20 ↗ (talk) 10:33, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks for alerting me to these fundamental changes in the structure of Pakistan cricket and for providing so many sources. I'll see what I can do, but I prefer to wait until the teams have actually played before giving them articles, so it may be some time before I produce the sort of thing you are looking for. Sammyrice (talk) 00:17, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

Don't know if you've seen this

User:BilledMammal/Mass Creation Draftification - there's a discussion at WT:CRIC ↗ as well. There are lots of New Zealanders on the list - Lugnuts was working through them in about 2016 I think. I've been working on the Otago list, adding what I can. The list at the link itself is difficult to use, so I'm focussing on anyone with a forename from A to F and seeing what I can get. There are clear criteria for inclusion on the list, so anything which has had >200 bytes added in the past won't make it on to the list, for example. Don't know if you have a particular view on this, but you might be interested. Blue Square Thing (talk) 18:22, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

:Thanks for alerting me to this, BST. I've always had my doubts about the value of these sub-stubs, but on the other hand they seem no worse than harmless, and they give the rest of us something to build on. So there's plenty of work for us to do to rescue dozens of worthy old players from Wikipedia oblivion. I've already seen one I should have worked on before now, and I'll get onto him soon to give him his 200+ bytes. Sammyrice (talk) 23:31, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

::Yeah, I'm on the same page with regard to the stubs, but it's actually going to be a lot easier to deal with them now than in the five years they'll be in draft. I thought you should know anyway as there seem to be quite a few who are notable and that we can find sources for. Blue Square Thing (talk) 11:15, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Hugh Aldons ↗

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|1=On 3 July 2024, '''''In the news ↗''''' was updated with an item that involved the article '''''Hugh Aldons ↗''''', which you created and updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page ↗. Step hen 22:56, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
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Shatrusalyasinhji ↗ Edits - Unsourced Content Added

Hello, I'm @Senapatiji, I noticed that you recently added content (without citing any source) which was removed by me for being factually incorrect. It would be helpful to others if you add reliable source of the content. If you think my edit was a mistake then please leave a message on my talk. Thanks. Senapatiji (talk) 05:13, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

It is sourced under "Personal life" later in the article. It doesn't need to be sourced in the lede if it is sourced later. There is a persistent Wikipedia contributor who insists that Shatrusalyasinhji is still the Maharaja; you say he never was; the source says he was between 1966 and 1971.Sammyrice (talk) 05:18, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

:The source cited fot that content under 'Personal life' is itself questionable because It's a private website, published, edited and maintained by a private entity solely on its own discretion.
:'''Arguments to support my claim'''
:# Article 18 under Fundamental rights in India ↗ of the Indian Constitution ↗ clear prohibits the State from conferring any titles (e.g. Raja ↗, Maharaja ↗, Nawab ↗) other than military or academic to any person.
:# The Twenty-sixth Amendment of the Constitution of India ↗ quoted in that section just abolished provision of privy purses ↗ (monetary payments) paid to the royal families, titles were abolished a long before on the commencement of the Indian Constitution in 1950.
:# The editor of that content relied solely on a single private website and cited no other reliable sources at all.
:# The princely state of Nawanagar ↗ itself ceased to exist after Digvijaysinhji Ranjitsinhji Jadeja ↗ (father of Shatrusalyasinhji ↗) signed the Instrument of Accession ↗ to the Dominion of India ↗ on 15 August 1947. Thus ending the long list of Maharajas of that princely state.
:# The person may have been called Maharaja by local public for being member of a family, associated with the erstwhile princely state, but this doesn't mean that he has officially held that title.
:Senapatiji (talk) 06:15, 30 March 2025 (UTC)
::Additionally, the source's (https://www.indianrajputs.com/about.php) content is largely derived from, and mirrors, existing Wikipedia articles. Senapatiji (talk) 07:59, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

Non-free rationale for File:Roy Harford 1967.jpg

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Thanks for uploading or contributing to ''':File:Roy Harford 1967.jpg ↗'''. I notice the file page specifies that the file is being used under the non-free content criteria ↗, but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Wikipedia is acceptable. Please go to the file description page ↗, and edit it to include a non-free rationale ↗.

If you have uploaded other non-free media, consider checking that you have specified the non-free rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'file' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions ↗" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "File" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described in section F6 of the criteria for speedy deletion ↗. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion ↗ and ask for a chance to fix the problem. If you have any questions, please ask them at the Media copyright questions page ↗. Thank you. — Ирука13 ↗ 15:53, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

File:Roy Harford 1967.jpg listed for discussion

30px|left ↗ A file that you uploaded or altered, :File:Roy Harford 1967.jpg ↗, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for discussion ↗. Please see the '''discussion''' ↗ to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you.  — Ирука13 ↗ 07:19, 15 January 2026 (UTC)

A barnstar for you

WP:DOB ↗ and WP:DOB ↗

We don't use primary sources like legal documents or government records for BLPs, especially with something that is a privacy concern like a date of birth. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:20, 7 July 2026 (UTC)

:See also WP:BLPPRIMARY ↗. TarnishedPathtalk 23:48, 7 July 2026 (UTC)
:Thanks for letting me know. It strikes me as a weird rule, counter-intuitive and self-defeating if we are trying to compile a reliable and comprehensive encyclopedia. Legal documents in the public domain, as in this case, would appear to me to be perfect sources. Sammyrice (talk) 00:12, 8 July 2026 (UTC)
::There are a variety of views on the subject. It has been discussed quite a bit at WT:BLP ↗. See the following search for discussions from WT:BLP's archives which reference BLPPRIMARY ↗. TarnishedPathtalk 05:12, 8 July 2026 (UTC)
:::Thanks for clarifying this matter, and letting me know that I'm not alone. Sammyrice (talk) 05:48, 8 July 2026 (UTC)
::::While you're not alone, support for maintaining the existing meaning and wording of the policy seems to be very solid. I don't know what it would take for that to change. TarnishedPathtalk 05:54, 8 July 2026 (UTC)